Informal poll... Obama or McCain?

[Jamestown]

For all you Country Music folk, I think Sammy Kershaw said it best:

"Let's talk about baseball
talk a little small talk
there's gotta be a good joke
that you've heard
let's talk about NASCAR
old Hollywood movie stars
let's talk about anything
anything in this world
but politics, religion and her"

[Pete (Mr. Marcia)]

Pete - You should know more than anyone that those babies have rights under the US Constitution, no?

Whats up with the Brew Crew?

The constitution makes no mention of fetuses...that's kind of the point.

Not a Badger fan, not a Brewers fan.

And, Soxfan, I actually hope the Red Sox do well because Ron is a Bosox fan.

We the people?

We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

[Pete (Mr. Marcia)]

Pete - You should know more than anyone that those babies have rights under the US Constitution, no?

Whats up with the Brew Crew?

The constitution makes no mention of fetuses...that's kind of the point.

Not a Badger fan, not a Brewers fan.

And, Soxfan, I actually hope the Red Sox do well because Ron is a Bosox fan.

We the people?

We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

Ya, I remember that part. But, you beg the question. The issue that we disagree on is whether a fetus is a person. Does the "people" in "we the people" include an unborn fetus? That's the issue.

If your answer is yes, then ask yourself whether all of the other rights conferred by the Constitution apply to a fetus. Can a fetus vote? Does a fetus have the right to hold property? Does a fetus have the right to bear arms? (That could be painful for the mother.)

If you answer yes to any of the above, your argument makes no sense because we all know that the Constitution does not afford the unborn those rights. If you answer no to any of the above, your original argument makes no sense because you are acknowledging that the Constitution, in fact, does not apply to a fetus.

The only pro-life argument that makes sense is the moral appeal...not the legal one.

[sailorgirl]

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[Bug]

I'm voting for Jorge ~ shaved balls and all

XOXO
Bug

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[soxfan22]

These kinds of conversations online don't do anyone any good. You are not going to change anyone's mind. All you will accomplish is hurt feelings.

I couldn't disagree more. The mainstream leftist media (ABC, NBC, CBS, CNN, NYT, LAT, etc) depend upon this type of outdated philosophy. "You don't talk politics at the water cooler". I say BS. Granted, I do not talk about it in front of my customers, but work is different.

They depend on this type of attitude because they know if that feeling prevails, nobody will ever discuss issues like:

*Obama raising the capital gains tax

*Obama raising corporate taxes (corporations don't pay taxes, they pass on to the consumer)

*Obama will institute a tax on all home sales

*Obama will raise the dividend tax

*Obama will raise your payroll taxes (ss, mcare, mcaid, fica)

*Obama will ship $845 BILLION to fight global poverty (and you think your taxes aren't going to go up?)

*Obama's support of late term abortions

*Obama's support of Infanticide

*The fact the Obama studied and implemented the community organizing techniques of Saul Alinsky, a long time supporter of communism

*The fact that Obama has only been in the Senate for 173 days

*The fact that while in the Illinois Senate, Obama voted "present" (no stand) 130 times

*The fact that Obama launched his political career in the living room of Bill Ayers - the man who bombed the Pentagon and a founder of the radical Weather Underground

*The fact that Franklin Raines, the former head of Fannie May who took home $90 million, is an Obama economic consultant

*The fact that Obama's wife said that for the first time in her adult life, she is proud to be an American

*The fact that Obama has a well-established relationship with ACORN, an extremely controversial ultra-left wing community organizing group under a perpetual cloud of voter fraud allegations (those old rumors of Daffy Duck casting a vote - that's ACORN)

So no, I don't think we should stop talking about these issues. These are important times, and we cannot depend on the national media to inform us...Last night Couric asked Palin what papers/magazines she reads...Are you kidding me?

In his interview with Couric, Biden said "...when the market crashed to start the great depression...Roosevelt didn't just talk about greed...He got on TV and led...".

Well, when the market crashed in 1929, Herbert Hoover was President, and of course, there were no TV's. Did Couric question him on that? Nope...on to the next question before someone notices!

If it were Palin, the NYT's, CNN, CBS, etc would still be talking about it.

[jmq]

Well, after being mislead into a mismanaged war, lowering respect for the US worldwide, having the economy go to hell, squandering a budget surplus, fiddling while New Orleans drowned, politicizing the Justice Dept., not implementing a coherent energy policy, deliberate stalling on climate change, and use of torture and warrantless eavesdropping, maybe, just maybe, I might consider giving somebody else a shot.

That said, Obama doesn’t have a chance due to the 800 lb. gorilla in the room. Not sayin this applies to anybody here, but I bet we all know someone to whom it will make a difference that he is "Hawaiian".

[soxfan22]

If your answer is yes, then ask yourself whether all of the other rights conferred by the Constitution apply to a fetus. Can a fetus vote? Does a fetus have the right to hold property? Does a fetus have the right to bear arms? (That could be painful for the mother.)

Umm...talk about silly arguements.

I will answer your questions with a question:

Can a fetus vote?

Well, no. But can a 12 year old?

Does a fetus have the right to hold property?

Well, not. But can a 12 year old?


Does a fetus have the right to bear arms?

Well, not. But does a 12 year old?

Now I ask you...Is a 12 year old a person?

My wife is scheduled for a c-section next Monday. I know that that thing in her belly, is indeed a human being...Living, breathing, eating, thinking, moving, heart beating, laughing, smiling, growing.

[Bug]

I'm voting for Jorge ~ shaved balls and all

XOXO
Bug

Do you really want me to disclose my thinking???

Your a hard working "regular" guy who puts his pants on just like the rest of us. You work each day to make a living while affording your employees a chance to make a living as well. You work hard & play hard. You see the difference between them. You do not take things to seriously and you know that you have to laugh at yourself now and then. Most important to me ~ you call things as you see them. It's not always the most popular thing to do, but you stay true to yourself.

I don't want the "sugar coated" version nor do I want anyone to blow smoke up my butt. Say it like it is Brother

Can you believe I got all this without ever even meeting you???? Scary huh?????

Hor-Hey for President

XOXO
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[sailorgirl]

If your answer is yes, then ask yourself whether all of the other rights conferred by the Constitution apply to a fetus. Can a fetus vote? Does a fetus have the right to hold property? Does a fetus have the right to bear arms? (That could be painful for the mother.)

Umm...talk about silly arguements.

I will answer your questions with a question:

Can a fetus vote?

Well, no. But can a 12 year old?

Does a fetus have the right to hold property?

Well, not. But can a 12 year old?


Does a fetus have the right to bear arms?

Well, not. But does a 12 year old?

Now I ask you...Is a 12 year old a person?

My wife is scheduled for a c-section next Monday. I know that that thing in her belly, is indeed a human being...Living, breathing, eating, thinking, moving, heart beating, laughing, smiling, growing.

None other than Antonin Scalia, not a "typical liberal" holds the following opinion:

"My job is to interpret the Constitution accurately. And indeed, there are anti-abortion people who think that the constitution requires a state to prohibit abortion. They say that the Equal Protection Clause requires that you treat a helpless human being that's still in the womb the way you treat other human beings. I think that's wrong. I think when the Constitution says that persons are entitled to equal protection of the laws, I think it clearly means walking-around persons."

[soxfan22]

Yeah, and Scalia also said this...

"U.S. Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia told a group of students on Monday at the Roger Williams University Law School that there is nothing in the Constitution guaranteeing abortion rights and that the issue is best left to legislatures rather than the Supreme Court, the AP/Boston Globe reports. "You want the right to abortion?" Scalia asked, adding, "Create it the way most rights are created in a democracy. Persuade your fellow citizens it's a good idea -- and pass a law."

[RickG]

Yeee haaa, I'll be on Honeymoon Beach on Tuesday November 4th. NoTanLines and I are going next week to do our Virginia early voting. We perfectly cancel each other out, in all likelihood.

Cheers, RickG

[sailorgirl]

Yeah, and Scalia also said this...

"U.S. Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia told a group of students on Monday at the Roger Williams University Law School that there is nothing in the Constitution guaranteeing abortion rights and that the issue is best left to legislatures rather than the Supreme Court, the AP/Boston Globe reports. "You want the right to abortion?" Scalia asked, adding, "Create it the way most rights are created in a democracy. Persuade your fellow citizens it's a good idea -- and pass a law."

Very true he did say that also, but I thought your point was the definition of "person" under the consitution. I was merley trying to point out that even the most convervative member of the Supreme Court does not hold the view that the word "person" in the Constitution refers to the not yet born.