Confused about how VRBO works

[needmesomesun]

I posted about this a while back. I do feel that the management companies that post villas there are really misleading. The name of the website is Vacation Rentals BY OWNER. Not Vacation Rentals Listed by their Management Companies. If people wanted to rent from a MC, they would check out MC websites, not visit VRBO.

It used to be a place where you could really contact an owner and then the MC's caught on a while back and began listing "for the owners." Which I find deceptive and dishonest. If you are resourceful enough, you can google the number associated with the listing and find out if it is a MC or not. Or, if you click the button that says "See all my listings" and there are 3 or more, you can almost assume it is a MC (unless it is one lucky individual).

I prefer to work with Owners. They seem to care so much more about your experience than a MC.

I find it completely disrespectful of the owners, who list and put hard work and effort into doing it all themselves, if a MC lists it there.

[dreamshark]

You make some good points, NeedMe. On the other hand, now that I realize how ambiguous the term "management company" really is, I'm willing to cut them all a little slack as long as the property is actually owned by a private individual and not a corporation.

With our 2009 villa, the owner managed the initial contact, booking and payment herself via email, but on-island management was through Cimmaron. With last year's villa, it was reversed - booking handled by Caribbean Villas but on-island management entirely taken care of by the owners. For the one I'm looking at now, it appears that GCG is handling both parts of the management task. But from all the reviews I've read, it's pretty clear that the villa is very much the property of loving owners who actually live there 4 months out of the year. So it seems fair enough to me that all these properties appear on VRBO.

What would be deceptive, IMHO, is a business that owns and manages multiple rental properties marketing them on VRBO. I love reading those sweet little owner bios and would be really distressed if I learned they were all being made up by off-shore workers in a corporate sweatshop somewhere! ( *ew* I hope nobody is actually doing that.)

[sherban]

The way I look at it, VRBO is just a website...a portal to opportunity...just like EBAY or what-ever. It's up to us ( the consumers) to make sure we get the deal we want....you have to ask the right questions and know what you want. I agree that there are more "managed" propoerties on VRBO these days, but that might not be a bad thing.

[jwwj]

Until recently we had a rental house on the outer banks of North Carolina. We had a contract with a rental company that prohibited us from renting on our own without giving them their management fee. We advertised on VRBO at our expense and listed both our email and the email for the management company. If the management company didn't respond promptly I'd respond to the inquiry and let them know the company would be in touch soon, I'd also ask specific questions about the house and furnishings and also to questions about discounts. I'd let the company handle the actual booking and the calendar.
For us VRBO was a means to reach a larger audience than just the ones who looked at the management companies websites. There was no intention to deceive or misrepresent.

[Xislandgirl]

With everything that is out on the interwebs, I think that Buyer beware is the most important thing to know.
I don't find it deceptive at all, as long as the owner is aware. You want your property to reach the most people in the most economical way. That is why you will see some villas on multiple websites. It is all about exposure.

When you find a property that you are interested in, I think it is up to you to do your due dilligence. Ask the right questions and make an informed decision.

There is an Allstate commercial that has a girl that says "if it is on the Internet, it has to be true" I crack up every time I see it. If it is on the internet, it is bound to be false.
Hey, I could be a 85 year old man living in the Yukon

[needmesomesun]

This became a huge problem on craigslist a while back. What they did was require the person creating the listing to verify if they were the owner or an agent. Now, in the search engine for craigslist, you can choose to pull only listings by owners and it cuts out all other listings from your search. Something like this would probably be more transparent.

There are a handful of websites run by the same company (including VRBO) for vacation rental listings, which don't have the word owner in the title. Unless I'm dealing directly with an owner I see no need for Rental/Management companies to list there. It does take away from all the owners who actually list there and take care of everything themselves.

I'll give an example of why I like to deal with owners. We rented a villa and the internet stopped working. We were informed that it had to do with weather/the actual service provider, etc. After days (they first said it was the weather, etc.), the manager decided it was the modem which we had already said wasn't the case. We arrived back at the villa one day to find the rep from management company dropping off a modem, still in a bag, on the dining room table "for us to install." I am 100% certain that the owner would have been mortified at that gesture. We had already spent a good deal of time trying to make it work. We weren't going to work on our vacation for a service that is advertised as an amenity. The manager seemed incredibly put out that he had to install something that he knew was going to be the fix (and we knew wasn't). As it turned out it didn't work and he then had to finally call someone in to deal with it. By then it was too late and we never had service for the duration of our stay.

There have been some positive experiences with management companies on STJ, but I have to say that for the most part (in any situation that required attention by a manager) we were made to feel like we were putting them out in a huge way. We have had the most positive experiences with owners. There used to be a site just for owner listings, and now it is cluttered with nearly every listing available on St. John. I guess you can justify it however you want, any everyone is entitled to their opinion.

[Xislandgirl]

Needmesomesun: Your interaction with the management company could not be any further from ours ( we have had some really gret ones) and that is the reason that I want to deal with someone on island and not an off island owner. I can speak face to face with an on island manager but I can only call or email an off island owner. (on island owners are a different story)

Everyone has different experiences and preferences when it comes to renting, there is no right or wrong. I still stand behind my thought that it is the internet and it is your responsibility to be dilligent in your research, no matter what the site name is.

[needmesomesun]

Needmesomesun: Your interaction with the management company could not be any further from ours ( we have had some really gret ones) and that is the reason that I want to deal with someone on island and not an off island owner. I can speak face to face with an on island manager but I can only call or email an off island owner. (on island owners are a different story)

Everyone has different experiences and preferences when it comes to renting, there is no right or wrong. I still stand behind my thought that it is the internet and it is your responsibility to be dilligent in your research, no matter what the site name is.

DeeDee - Clearly even the OP was confused by his interaction with a management company. Of course it is the internet and everyone should do their due diligence, nobody is suggesting otherwise. But clearly, at the very least, it is misleading. Now, how it is only dishonest to the owner, if the OP along with a whole bunch of other people expected to speak with owners, is beyond me. Also, as stated in my post, we have had positive experiences....

[Xislandgirl]

Needmesomesun: Your interaction with the management company could not be any further from ours ( we have had some really gret ones) and that is the reason that I want to deal with someone on island and not an off island owner. I can speak face to face with an on island manager but I can only call or email an off island owner. (on island owners are a different story)

Everyone has different experiences and preferences when it comes to renting, there is no right or wrong. I still stand behind my thought that it is the internet and it is your responsibility to be dilligent in your research, no matter what the site name is.

DeeDee - Clearly even the OP was confused by his interaction with a management company. Of course it is the internet and everyone should do their due diligence, nobody is suggesting otherwise. But clearly, at the very least, it is misleading. Now, how it is only dishonest to the owner, if the OP along with a whole bunch of other people expected to speak with owners, is beyond me. Also, as stated in my post, we have had positive experiences....

We can agree to disagree. I find the entire internet to be suspect and misleading so I seldom take a site name at face value, but I may just be a skeptic, in general

[PA Girl]

I am 100% certain that the owner would have been mortified at that gesture.

I think it depends on the owner

We rented a house in Peter Bay, high season. Upon arrival, there were many things not acceptable for the price of the house but I will give just one example. There weren't enough beach towels.

I got on the phone immediately with the management company. Their response was "the owners say to use bath towels, they won't approve an expenditure for beach towels." Sorry, but for a $xx,xxx rental, I expect at least one beach towel per person and I told the management agency that. The management agency purchased and delivered beach towels later that night. (still in the bag with receipt, which is how I knew the purchase was that night)

In my case, the management company made the situation right when the owner would not.

After the trip, I shared my other complaints with the rental agency. Their response to most of the items was "the owner won't take care of that, the owner was suppose to replace XYZ but didn't" and so on.

Unrelated but didnt' someone on the forum get scammed by a rouge VRBO listing?

[needmesomesun]

I am 100% certain that the owner would have been mortified at that gesture.

I think it depends on the owner

We rented a house in Peter Bay, high season. Upon arrival, there were many things not acceptable for the price of the house but I will give just one example. There weren't enough beach towels.

I got on the phone immediately with the management company. Their response was "the owners say to use bath towels, they won't approve an expenditure for beach towels." Sorry, but for a $xx,xxx rental, I expect at least one beach towel per person and I told the management agency that. The management agency purchased and delivered beach towels later that night. (still in the bag with receipt, which is how I knew the purchase was that night)

In my case, the management company made the situation right when the owner would not.

After the trip, I shared my other complaints with the rental agency. Their response to most of the items was "the owner won't take care of that, the owner was suppose to replace XYZ but didn't" and so on.

Unrelated but didnt' someone on the forum get scammed by a rouge VRBO listing?

Yes, a VRBO account got hacked (not sure if it was a by owner listing, or an agency listing ) and a forum member wired money somewhere. I think it was recommended never to wire money to anyone on the internet and to also talk to the owner by phone first (hence the OP wanting to speak with an owner I think). Really interesting about the beach towels (A Peter Bay owner being stingy with towels!!). The same manager said we could only have two towels and to "please use them repeatedly" but we borrowed some from another bedroom as we didn't want to use the same towels we brought to the beach in the pool area, for sand reasons, etc.

[PA Girl]

Oh yeah, stingy does even begin to describe it! My dad always said the more money people have, the less likely they are to part with it.

I actually had a heads up about the beach towels from a fellow forum member that rented a neighboring Peter Bay house from the same agency.

So I thought I would be proactive and emailed the agency ahead of time and their response was along the lines of "silly girl, this villa is luxury, everything is top notch, you will want for nothing...."

Upon arrival, the greeter asks me to sign a paper stating that we will be charged $100 per towel for any missing beach towels. (I had no problem with being held responsible for a lost item.)

When I brought it to their attention that there were only 6 towels, he said the others were in the bedrooms. Something made me go look and nope, no other towels. He pushed me to sign it anyway, saying the towels must be somewhere but I refused and got on the phone with the management company.

The condition of the pots, pans and kitchen stuff at that house was shameful. Peeling teflon, melted spatulas, mismatched glasses. It was apparent that someone was nickel and diming the small but necessary expenditures that come with owning a rental property.

[dreamshark]

Ooookay, I think I've gotten what I needed from this discussion. Thanks, all! Here's what I've learned.

I realize now that many owners, possibly an increasing number, who have properties listed on VRBO also use a property management company for one or both of the following services: 1) Initial contact and booking and 2) on-island management. You should never assume that the same party who handles the initial contact also handles on-island management. If you want to know, ask.

Sometimes the management company (if there is one) tacks on an additional 5% service fee. If that is the case, this fee should be noted in the rates section of the VRBO listing. (As far as my experience goes, it always is).

It is rarely clear from the VRBO listing that a management company is involved, and if so what it's role is. IMHO, the VRBO site format would be greatly improved by including a standardized way to to provide that information. However, at the moment this is information that potential renters should try to find out, because it can have a big effect on the whole rental experience.

In the interests of being helpful to future renters, it would be a nice idea for people who write villa reviews and trip reports on sites such as this to include the name and role of the management company and an indication of whether their services were satisfactory. I'll plan to do that from now on. Just for the record, the management companies I mentioned earlier in this thread (Caribbean Villas and Cimmaron) did a fine job and I would be happy to rent properties managed by either of them in the future.

[PSUWethr]

I just thought I would weigh in on this conversation based on our VRBO listing and hopefully clear up some issues. My parents have a house in Coral Bay that they rent out when they are not on island. They have a property manager who is responsible for making sure the house gets cleaned, the pool is maintained, the house inventory is always stocked. She does receive a fee for every rental but in our case this is already worked into the weekly rental price so we do not mention it on VRBO. Some people might pay a management fee based on other parameters such as number of people, lenght of stay, etc. If they do charge and extra fee, they should clearly state that in their listing on VRBO. The hotel tax is a flat 10% of the rental and is applicable for every rental (altough some listers may already inclue this in their price as well). How the villa management seems to work is the owners of the property pick one company to "hold" the calendar. This means that whoever books the villa must make sure this "calendar holder" gets the resevation info in order to avoid double bookings. This company usually gets a small fee to hold the calendar and most villa owners have this already worked into their rates.

It is a shame that there are issues that try to ruin it for VRBO. Note that VRBO does not get any money from the rentals and we only pay a yearly fee to belong to their website. Most of the contacts I get ask me up front who I am and how I relate to the property and I have no problem telling them who I am.

Finally, I wish everyone visiting St. John will have a great experience. It is sad to hear that some rentals do not have all the necessary amenities such as enough beach towels, escpecially if they are paying a decent amount of money for the rental. We try to make every amenity availbe to our renters (from yoga mats, to toothbrushes, deoderant and suntan lotion) One thing that can help us villa owners is feedback from our renters. If you have a great time, please give us reviews. If you have a problem or something is wrong, let us know too! We welcome comments so we can get things fixed as soon as possible.

Hope this helps!