Good luck with your new president and the inauguration

[flip-flop]

Sox - Answer a few of the questions I have posed and I will truly consider an answer to your question. Until then, I will just assume its another "let's divert attention and change the subject" move.

You can start with either of these as they were both genuine questions related to the discussion at hand - the moratorium on tribunals at Gitmo, its eventual closing and what to do with the detainees who are cleared for release.

If the perpetrator of the attack on the USS Cole (in 2000 right?) has been at Gitmo all this time why haven't they held the tribunal? How long as he been in custody? Why did the the Bush Administration not bring him to justice?

Many detainees have been there for over 6 years. Is it preferred that they just rot there forever?

Was Bush on a particularly speedy path to bringing them to justice? Any path?

If I were the wife of a terror victim 6 or 8 years to bring people that we have in custody would infuriate me.

If you are willing to engage in a true back and forth expression of ideas I am open to that. I am not down with a continual changing of the subject when it suits you.

[flip-flop]

I guess you were out there marching in DC today for the same "basic human rights" you so passionately want for some of our enemies.

Like I said before give me a plan first, this is all symbolic until a plan is designed. It would have happened no matter who was elected president. This is not a big deal. It will be if it is botched.

Agreed, both Mccain and Obama were closing gitmo. Symbolism always comes before the nuts and bolts. The guy has literally been in office 34 hours, Bush did nothing in 6+ years to move us in this direction. At least its a start.

[soxfan22]

Ahab, I don't know what your white whale is, but it clearly torments you.

Not to worry, Pete...I have not thrown my "pipe" overboard...yet.

Although I think my wife thinks I have.

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[Pete (Mr. Marcia)]

Not to worry, Pete...I have not thrown my "pipe" overboard...yet.


Good to know. We all need happiness and hope.

[soxfan22]

Sox - Answer a few of the questions I have posed and I will truly consider an answer to your question. Until then, I will just assume its another "let's divert attention and change the subject" move.

If the perpetrator of the attack on the USS Cole (in 2000 right?) has been at Gitmo all this time why haven't they held the tribunal? How long as he been in custody? Why did the the Bush Administration not bring him to justice?

Looks like the detainee had been at Gitmo since 2002, but wasn't charged with the Yemen attack until 2008. Below is a link to the July 1 2008 story in the San Diego tribune...He was one of the possible "waterboarding" victims. Seems to me that if he wasn't formally charged until mid-2008, and was set for trial in late January 2009, that seems about right. Pete's an attorney, what do you think as far as the timetable is concerned?

http://www.signonsandiego.com/uniontrib ... 1cole.html

Many detainees have been there for over 6 years. Is it preferred that they just rot there forever?

You will not like my answer, but if they have been deemed a threat to our troops and society, then yes. We saw what happened when 61 were released.

And again, it took 6 years to get the confession out of the Cole bomber.

Was Bush on a particularly speedy path to bringing them to justice? Any path?

See my answer on al-Nashiri, the Cole bomber. I will not pretend to have any knowledge of the others.

If I were the wife of a terror victim 6 or 8 years to bring people that we have in custody would infuriate me.

Agreed. But, this guy was in custody for 6 years without being charged. Only when subjected to waterboarding did he admit to carrying out the Cole bombing, and then subsequently charged.

This goes back to your question about "sitting there to rot". I don't think we can expect that we should capture them, fly them all the way to cuba, ask them a few questions as if they were a suspect in a 7-11 robbery, and then release them on their testimony that they are not terrorists. I would think these things take time, and this is a perfect example.

If you are willing to engage in a true back and forth expression of ideas I am open to that. I am not down with a continual changing of the subject when it suits you.

Why must you be so condescending and patronizing? I believe I complimented you on your ability to put together a coherent thought time after time, even though I don't agree with you on any political issue whatsoever.

As Obama said in his speech, "The time has come to set aside childish things".

Now your turn. How about Clinton? I really feel like you and I are making progress here.

[Pete (Mr. Marcia)]

Don't drag me into this just because I'm an attorney. I represent businesses in employment matters. So, if some guy yanks his johnson out at work and someone is offended and files suit, I'm your guy.

Other than that, I know nothing.

[soxfan22]

Don't drag me into this just because I'm an attorney. I represent businesses in employment matters. So, if some guy yanks his johnson out at work and someone is offended and files suit, I'm your guy.

Other than that, I know nothing.

That's hysterical.

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[sailorgirl]

I don't think one needs a law degree(although I do have one) to question whether holding someone for six years without charges, in isolation, subjecting them to what has euphemistically been called "enhanced interogation techinques", obtaining a "confession" after the application of said techniques is something that this country should be involved in. Wouldn't you be at all concerned about the validity of the confession gained in such a way. Its precisily why Courts do not permit the introduction of evidence obtained in this way. It is simply not reliable. Just ask John McCain! He admits he would have told them just about anything to make them stop.

[soxfan22]

Sailorgirl...The question about "forced/false confession" is a good one.

I just happened to find this article on the web. I think everyone who has an interest in this Cole bomber, Al-Nashiri, should read it...It actually includes some of the dialogue from his interrogation at gitmo and his history as it pertains to osama bin laden. Very interesting stuff, and it touches on your question of false confession, the ACLU, etc.

Oh, and it's new...posted on January 16, 2009.

http://www.longwarjournal.org/archives/ ... lotter.php

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[soxfan22]

Did you read that article on the cole bomber, SJ?

[soxfan22]

I'm sure you have seen the videos of hostages forced into confessions just before their heads were cut off by the same type of guys we have down there. If they had the opportunity, they would do the same to you or me. I'm not saying what we did was right. All I want is a plan before some symbolic gesture.

Yes, I went online and watched, I believe it was Daniel Berg...Watched his head get chopped off, and then held up in front of the camera like a trophy. It ruined me for months, and I hadn't thought about that for a few years, so thanks for the reminder (sarcasm).
That was probably the biggest mistake I have ever made. But then again, you don't know evil if you don't see it.

The sad part? There was not NEARLY the outrage from the world community or the ACLU as compared to say, the Abu Ghraib incident.

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