Okay...just gotta ask

[California Girl]

Why the hell isn't the same approach taken with alcohol that was taken with cigarettes? They should start taxing the crap out of it until the price of a six pack has quadrupled.

I've thought that for years! I quit smoking when cigarettes went up to $.75 a pack and I really can't believe that people are still smoking them at $5.00 a pack! Abusers will always be abusers, some people will always have addictive personalities. I consider myself fortunate that I'm not an addictive person. I've smoked pot for 40 yrs. and I am not "addicted"... I go on and off of it frequently without any problems, and other than a few "trials" in the 70's I've never been inclined to move on to harder substances. I have a medicine cabinet with 3 old bottles of Vicodin in it and I have no desire to take it unelss I'm sick. In my opinion a "gateway" is not a drug...it's an excuse created by those who are abusers.

How many people have died from cigarette-related diseases? How many people do you know who have died of a marijuana-related illness? Which one is worse? Which one is legal?

[soxfan22]

Why the hell isn't the same approach taken with alcohol that was taken with cigarettes? They should start taxing the crap out of it until the price of a six pack has quadrupled.

More social engineering through taxation? Where will it end, Cid? There are many, many things that impact the whole of us negatively.

And more importantly, there are many, many pieces of legislation that have been passed and implemented that have had a negative impact on society, rather than the positive impact for which it was designed.

One thing that has always bothered me is the law here in CT (not sure if law is federal or not, don't feel like looking it up) that makes smoking in bars illegal. I am not a smoker, nor have I ever been...However, it is the right of the business owner, and he alone, to make the determination as to whether or not he/she will allow patrons to smoke in their establishment. Just as it is my right as a man to make a decision to patronize such establishments or not.

Many people chew tobacco...Should we also tax the heck out of chewing tobacco, you know, for the "greater good"?

[California Girl]

Smoking in public places is all but banned in California and that's a very good thing! I don't want to breathe other people's smoke and it's certainly not healthy. I am glad it's been banned so that I can enjoy a drink in a bar or a meal in a restaurant, or a ride on public transportation and not have to breathe someone else's smoke, or worse yet, end up smelling like an ashtray because of it. Even though you can't smoke inside a building here, some people still stand outside by the front door of office buildings or the grocery store and I still have to walk through their smoke to enter or leave the building. I always hold my breath because not only do I not want to breathe second-hand smoke, it STINKS!

Maybe you don't believe all legislation is good, and that may be true, but anti-smoking laws are some of the best laws ever enacted, IMO. Personally, I'd love to see all smoking outlawed. And I don't even want to start on chewing tobacco! Gross gross, gross! That's more filthy than cigarettes...spitting in any form is offensive and unsanitary!

[soxfan22]

Maybe you don't believe all legislation is good, and that may be true, but anti-smoking laws are some of the best laws ever enacted, IMO. Personally, I'd love to see all smoking outlawed. And I don't even want to start on chewing tobacco! Gross gross, gross! That's more filthy than cigarettes...spitting in any form is offensive and unsanitary!

It's not my belief that not all legislation is good, is a a provable, documented fact.

You know what offends me? Other dudes who wear too much cologne. It gives me a headache, and I run into it in nearly every bar/happy hour situation. I think we need a law.

You know what else also offends me? When you go to a club in a major city (take Vegas for example)...If you do not have three beautiful women on your arm, you ain't gettin' in. I think we need a law, because this is clearly discrimination, and it could cause me mental distress. After all, it's not my fault that I was born a 6'1", 200 lb, average looking white guy.

How about the helmet law? If I choose to be careless with my melon on a bike, then that is my right to choose, no? Why do I need a legislator (who likely doesn't pay his own taxes) telling me how to protect the coconut? Am I endangering others?

I just happen to believe that we can't legislate all risk and discomfort out of life. Prior to the smoking ban in restaurants, there were plenty of places to go that did not allow smoking in their establishment. This law did not save us from the "eventuality" that we all get Lung Cancer...It took choice, liberty, and free will away.

No thanks.

[sherban]

Terry- I wasn't even aware that MJ decrim was going on, interesting...I mean I heard of it in Calif...but hey, that's Calif...

XO- I do not think pot is a gateway to harder drugs but it can be a stepping stone along the way if that is where you want to go.

I sometimes like to compare drugs to sex, there are some intersting similarities and paradoxes. Both have been around forever and will never go away, both can be addicting and abused, it could be argues that both have the same level of necessity although I do get procreation...just saying that some drugs are very important...
Does a kiss lead to bisexuality? Does a kiss lead to becoming a pedophile...well it could, I guess.
I do not want my kids using drugs ever...no need for it. But if they needed it for their health I would fight for it.
Sometimes I wonder what would happen if many drugs illegal today were legalized and "controlled" by government...imagine what it would be like to take that income from smugglers and murders and give it to the government...and not spend hundreds of millions on chasing the bad guys...just put them out of business...?

[California Girl]

imagine what it would be like to take that income from smugglers and murders and give it to the government...and not spend hundreds of millions on chasing the bad guys...just put them out of business...?

ABSOLUTELY!!

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[California Girl]

Sherban - you are assuming the government could grow and sell (tax) cheaper than the Mexicans. You would still need to have security chasing bad guys trying to deliver other illegal drugs. You are not suggesting we legalize cocaine, meth, and heroine are you?

SJ, we have plenty of Mexicans here to grow & cultivate it (pot only), and they work cheap!

[JT]

I'm not too fond of the government taxing/controlling pot. I think if they do there will always be an alternative market. I don't often see eye to eye with Sox, but I also hate so much government intervention in our personal lives. I was only 13 years old when I read Animal Farm and Brave New World. Both had lasting effects as to my interpretations of how the government meddles into some of the most innocuous aspects of our lives. If the government had control of pot it would only be a matter of time before some nosepot bureaucrat or another would be insisting on some stupid regulations on the THC content allowed, or restrict sales on Sunday, etc.

[Terry]

Interesting discussion here. I have to agree with CAGirl on legalization. It would definitely help the economy if it brought in some tax dollars.

JT, you cracked me up with your comment on 'not available on Sundays'. When we first moved to CO, we could not go out for a burger and beer on Sundays. Everything was closed because in the town we moved to, it competed with church activities. That was frustrating to us. This State just recently passed opening liquor stores on Sunday. But we still cannot buy alcohol (except for 3.2 beer) in a grocery store. Consequently, we'll never see a Trader Joes until that is changed.

Some laws are really stupid when it comes to alcohol and pot.

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[Terry]

http://marijuanabusinessreporter.com/?p=170

If you can open this, this is what I'm referring to. Upscale shops selling "medical MJ". There are supposedly strict rules on the growers that sell to these shops. It's cleaner than you get off the street. There is various grades that you can purchase. It's perscription pot.

I don't think that growing your own will ever be legal in the government's eyes. They would miss out on too much money....tax wise.

The crime that has been created from these shops is burglary. These shops are being robbed and most robberies are not stealing the pot, but the cash! The price of this type of boutique pot is not cheaper than street pot. It's better quality, it's cleaner.

These shops pay taxes. The government is making a cut.

[California Girl]

When you buy pot on the street, you are supporting a very dirty trade. There is blood all over it and that will never change. And it sucks.

That's true, but it was the very same thing with prohibition... the mob was all over it! Big money was made by rum runners and moonshiners, but it didn't stop people from frequenting speakeasys. That law was changed and legalizing booze and taxing it didn't seem to lead to legalizing other things in the same genre. I think pot could be legalized without including cocaine, meth & heroin. Those are hard drugs...they ruin lives. Pot isn't that way. Legalizing it would take the blood out of it.

[Terry]

Well since women were behind Prohibition and the Temperance Movement, maybe women can get pot legalized in the U.S. (Sorry guys)

"Because of the correlation between drinking and domestic violence—many drunken husbands abused family members—the temperance movement existed alongside various women's rights and other movements, including the Progressive movement, and often the same activists were involved in all of the above."

Maybe if we legalized pot and the gov't got their share of the sales, we wouldn't be talking about a health care issue???

[soxfan22]

I was only 13 years old when I read Animal Farm and Brave New World. Both had lasting effects as to my interpretations of how the government meddles into some of the most innocuous aspects of our lives.

I agree with you on Animal Farm. Great read! I haven't read Brave New World, though now I will check it out.

Also, I enjoyed 1984 by Orwell. I'm sure you read that, JT?