USVI-On-Line

bride & I started regular visits to stj in fall 2004 and both fell in love with the island. we've been back 8 times plus i've been back 4 more times with a snorkel buddy on shorter trips without her. always stayed in villas with panoramic views (12 west facing with sunsets and 1st east facing on bordeaux). 8 very different villas and would go back to all if season and trip budget matched. our share of average nightly rates have ranged from $200 a nite (just the 2 of us off season) to almost $400 (last minute in season for 2 of us in larger gifft hill villa stay). we always rent our jeep on stt and by the time you factor in gas & barge fees, aver cost is about $75 per day. when we travel with another couple averages villa costs us about $200 a night and jeep costs are 50% less. point: stj ain't cheap traveling as a couple but we enjoy.

i've always known the bride detested the trips to & from stj (lot of time w/o a cig) and was horrified of car trips to beach. she tolerated because we both loved the beautifyul views, various lovely beaches for sunning, reading and my snorkeling. i don't ever recall the bride getting her hair wet except during showers (on beach or in bath). after extensive discussions, what she wants is a panoramic view & a variety of "instant beaches" for our enjoyment WITHOUT a hyperventilating drive. well we all know stj has that, and it's called caneel bay. i've never snorkeled, honeymoon, caneel, scott, turtle nor caneel hawksnest so sounds like something i could like. they offer private transportation from the airport to the resort via charlotte a not red hook so only very short drive to/fro airport.. while we are not big restuarant diners, caneel does offer a variety of dining options, the resort is large enough with limited number of rooms so she probably never feels crowded. BUT have you checked prices even in off season, at those rates and what i'm assuming you'll pay for food, it must be paradise.

based on my estimates of off season rates and food costs, 7 nights off-season at caneel in an ocean view room (7 nites is brides minimum stay on stj due to the travel hassel) will cost about same as 20 days in a villa which would be two 10 day trips or for a little more 3 trips in villa. she has put up with me for almost 45 years, so maybe i need to shuffle our vacationing budget and go for caneel ONE TIME. two concerns: first, after the past 13 trips with villa stays and the great views, are we/she likely to to be happy in a room at caneel (not a lot of space, limited views, always dining out) and second, would i be creating a monster where caneel becomes the first word mentioned after stj?

based on some of the feed back i'm getting from her as i talked about some of the stj villa options, i believe the bloom is off the rose so to speak. so, if i'm to get her back, it'll take caneel.

the issue is a lot like luxury vs cheaper for more stays, but to me more like choosing between a chevy (which we each drive) vs a high end lexus (which i'd never consider buying unless i win the lottery or congress repeals income taxes) because i'm very value minded on every thing. what's the take of those of you who have stayed frequently in both villas and at caneel? can we buy happiness at caneel? and what's the thoughts of all you wise folks who understand what it takes to maintain marital bliss? should i go broke on one last trip to stj, work on another buddy trip or forget about stj until bride thinks it's time to go back so i'll have some leverage?

looking for sage advice.

papabou

What does she say about it? It sounds like STJ is your favorite vacation spot but not hers. Where does she prefer to go?

We have found that Caneel is the perfect way to end out stay on STJ. I wouldn't want to spend our entire trip there because I enjoy the villa experience and like to have a kitchen and washer and dryer at my disposal but we love having 4 days at the end of our trip to indulge ourselves a bit and have the beautiful beaches of Caneel to enjoy. We turn in our Jeep and stay put at Caneel. We love the luxury of the private ferry and taxi to the airport on departure day.

diana,

interesting point. now that you've mentioned it, she likes stj while i love it.

seems maybe she has two favs. first, fla atlantic and gulf coasts where we go frequently and rent condo's on beach. been doing for 30 years and plan to continue. she likes her own little nest as long as beach front and direct acess. i figured a villa with a view on stj and a short drive to the beach was a fair trade.

she also seems to always be ready for club med cancun, short flt out of atlanta and 10 minute cab from airport. we never leave club med compound. so i figured she'd like caneel, but then she's more value conscious than me, so i couldn't tell what we're paying for caneel.

we've tried a couple of trips where we moved mid trip and we both agree, not again. we want to get settled in for the duration. old folks like familiar & little change.

i guess the answer is obvious, take her where she likes to go and as as long as she's happy with me going off with the guys, i go to stj without her unless she asks to come along.

does that sound reasonable or have i missed another obvious issue, like i should have posted this on dear abby?

Oh boy, Caneel versus Villa is an "issue" in our marriage, as much as a vacation "issue" can be while still smiling.

A little bit about my point of view - I am the household CEO in addition to working full time.

Yes, I could go on vacation and say f-it husband - you wash the towels, you worry about food, you plan for packing for the beach each day but the reality is, it doesn't work that way. He doesn't do those things at home and he isn't going to do them on vacation. (I tried it once and it did not work, at all.) For me, a villa vacation is just like home but in a much better location and a lot more booze.

We have 5 Caneel vacations under our belt and at least than many villa vacations on STJ, many more on other islands.

Thoughts -

As a hardcore ex smoker who replaced a pack a day habit with a nicotiine gum habit, has she tried gum to take off the travel craving? Seriously, I think gum provides a better fix then the cigs. I an now off both but really, she should look into it.

panoramic view & a variety of "instant beaches" for our enjoyment WITHOUT a hyperventilating drive - hmmm this might be a tall order. While I adore Caneel, because you are on the beach, you don't get the same time of hill views. We do love the view from the Hawksnest rooms, which gives you the hills and beach views.

Will you be creating a monster by going to Caneel? Possibly. My husband jokes that our honeymoon at Canel spoiled us forever. But, we are both all about the beach.

Can you buy happiness at Caneel? Probably but only if you both enjoy the same vibe on vacation. In our marriage? Absolutely.

Our last trip to Caneel was in July and even my pro-villa husband will admit we spent much more time hanging ont he beach, snorkelling and, most importantly, spending family time together then when we rent a villa.

We didn't rent Jeep so we saved money there. Trips to town were $30 or so dollars (and back with tip) per day only on the days we went to town. We weren't eating lunch out so that was another cost savings. Caneel's breakfast buffet is huge. Even my husband, who is a bottomless pit, was never hungry for lunch.

We are early birds so by 9am each morning, we were done with breakfast and on the beach. More beach time, less cooler packing time and less driving time was absolutley worth it to me. The first time we stayed over in Chocolate Hole, I figured we were spending over an hour and half each day "commuting" to the beach and to dinner each day.

All my raving aside, does your wife like getting in the water at all? If she doesn't I would say take her where she likes to go. You will be paying for the fantastic beach access. Caneel is a very specific place and I can understand why it isn't for everyone.

pa girl,

i can relate to your opening comments but the bride has been kept woman for 43 of our 45 yrs (she taught our 1st 2 yrs of law school). she's happy anywhere there's water, sunshine and nice views. but since Jaws came out she does not get in the water. probably her fav vacations are anywhere with a breach front condo with all the conveniences of home. she'd just as soon we eat in as go out to dinner and looks at right side of menu when we go out. she does seem happy at a beach front resort/hotel couple times a year.

i'm convinced we would both enjoy caneel, she more than me since i'm a guy who according to a travel buddy "once we're settled someplace, he's ready to move on to somewhere else". that's why i love stj and bride tolerates, 98% of the scenery is nice and to me the drive is part of the fun.

as i said to diana, the answer probably is i go to stj and for the money we'd spend at caneel, take the bride on a couple of extra beach resort trips or fla beach condo trips.

guess i ought to thankful she has been as flexible as she has been.

papabou

papabou wrote:as i said to diana, the answer probably is i go to stj and for the money we'd spend at caneel, take the bride on a couple of extra beach resort trips or fla beach condo trips.

guess i ought to thankful she has been as flexible as she has been.

papabou

Papa,

after 45 years, you know what is best! It sounds like "your" STJ trip and "her" beach condo trip(s) is the key to a long partnership, don't mess with success!

I say give Caneel a try once. It doesn't sound to me like you're in a position where you will be blowing 3 years worth of vacation budget on a trip to Caneel. Caneel is different. There will be some things you don't like. You won't have the space of a villa or condo. But the convenience of the beautiful beaches will offset that.

The worst you'll be able to say is that you overpaid. But I don't think you'll be able to say you didn't have a nice trip.

We've been to both and Caneel is way a more wonderFul experience than Club Med Cancun!

Ha! Papa, I wrote about the same things in a TR here about our 09 Caneel trip. In a similar manner, I had to “give in” because I made them rough it on Anegada the year before, and had similar concerns that you have:

“This trip report covers six nights 6/18 – 6/24 to St. John. We stayed at Gallows Point and Caneel Bay. Family of 3, fifth time to VIs, last trip was the adventurous June 08 journey to “rustic” Anegada and Virgin Gorda, detailed in a multi-part TR on the off topic forum a year ago (because it was BVIs only).

It was during that trip that my wife and daughter decided they needed more luxury and less schlepping and started conspiring against me saying stuff like next time they would go to Caneel (yeah, right, at what $495+ a night for “garden view”? Good luck with that) and I can go off to an even smaller island or maybe a piece of driftwood.

So as the economy went into the toilet last fall, we didn’t make any plans, saying: let’s tighten the belt; yeah, we’re Caribbean-ed out; let’s save for that trip to Italy instead sometime in the nebulous future; some of the colleges my daughter is looking at are $$$; yada yada.

Well, guess what? It really sucks psychologically over the winter not to have any warm weather vacation plans in the can. I mean, I didn’t realize (or forgot) how just knowing you will be on a beach in X months or days does help get you through.

Then a gray winter rolls into a cool, gray, wet spring and it starts driving you a little batty, and my wife points out, hey shouldn’t you wait til AFTER either one of us gets laid off to forgo vacation? We never got swept up in the credit mess, our employers are doing OK (as far as we can tell), etc. Go argue with that logic.

So in late March we start looking at dates and see only six midweek nights available at end of school and before start of summer camp counselor job. We start looking at the airfares for that timeframe, and then where to go. With only 6 nights, we really need to minimize time traveling to the islands, so BVIs are out, and also maximize beach time by minimizing “jeep time” while on the island, so an out of the way villa doesn’t work for us. In fact, (forum quasi-sacrilege warning) the villa thing doesn’t work that well for us in general because we are beach people AND the time and effort required for food shopping/food prep/cooking/clean up (i.e. K.P. or “kitchen patrol”) and doing house work kind of stuff does not fly well at all on vacation, so that throws a lot of the cost effectiveness of a villa out the window. Probably makes more sense with larger families or crews that can share those duties.

That said, it means we are looking at Gallows. But what’s this? Caneel running a special for $325 a night, ocean view, includes that big breakfast buffet and a $200 resort credit?

I guess there is an upside to a down economy, plus we can make the girls scheme a reality. It’s a scramble to get the room for our dates as they are booking quickly after the deal is announced. We were able to get it for 4 nights, doing the first 2 at Gallows, which is fine with us – we done it before (on a summertime pay for 5 get 7 nights deal) and enjoy the views, the easy walk into town, don’t have to get the jeep right away, etc. Don’t need the jeep for the entire time at Caneel too = more savings.”

also this:
“Then off to the check in at Caneel. Tried not to act like the Clampets. Smooth, early check in to ocean view upper #48. They had the requested mini fridge and extra bed set up (a real bed, not a pull out or cot), and bottle of Cruzan estate dark. The girls are so excited about the nice toiletries, robes, etc. that they start giggling madly, high five each other, and shout “YES!”

While I am happy that they are happy, I’m thinking that once they get a sample of the breakfast buffet, it’s gonna be difficult to go back to a place like Guavaberry on VG or Neptunes on Anegada. Suddenly, I’m very afraid just simple and clean may not cut it anymore.”

“…Taxi is $5 pp. We were without the jeep for the last day and a half. The idea for us was to minimize jeep time and maximize beach time since this was a short trip of only 6 nights and it worked perfectly.
Plus, the added bonus for us of being walking distance to the beach is for things like this: my wife really enjoys the beach in the morning (few things better in the world than enjoying that first cup of complimentary coffee on the beach), I like it in the late afternoon. So if we are on the beach in the late afternoon, just about the time the lighting is getting real interesting for photography, she starts squirming and saying I gotta get out of this bathing suit, etc.
Well, here (and on Spring Bay beach when we stay at Guavaberry on Virgin Gorda), she picks up and says I going back to take my shower. Great, I'll be up soon, and the getting ready to go out for the evening gets nicely staggered.
Also, one morning I was up extra early, peaked outside, sunrise looked promising, grabbed the camera, slipped out, coffee is set up at 6am at the beach bar, grabbed a to go cup, walked over to the other side of the Caneel peninsula to watch dawn break.”

“…Although this trip could only be six nights, it felt longer because of early non-stop flight coming, later afternoon flight leaving, and Caneel allowed minimization of jeep time and maximization of beach time for a reasonable price when you consider that you can count that breakfast buffet as 2 meals (= more time and $ savings). It’s a beautiful property with 7 beautiful beaches and great snorkeling. While other beaches had significant skeeter issues while we were on island, they were never bad at Caneel. I saw no evidence of spraying – hopefully they just do a better job of controlling standing water and the like. Plus, we were told it was 90% full, but it never seemed like it.”

“…since we only had 6 nights available, it was essential to minimize every sort of travel time we could, including jeep time. The disclaimer here is that we are big time beach people, unlikely to be laying around a pool at a villa all day long (not that there is ANYTHING wrong with that) so this worked for us. You do see some of the large families and others who look like they have money and may be regular resort or urban types at the breakfast buffet, some of whom look like they may not venture off the property much (as indicated in some of the reviews you see on TripAdvisor). But, then again, the beaches away from the main Caneel beach weren’t crowded either, and the on property snorkeling was quite good, with the coral at Turtle Bay in great shape reminding me of Waterlemon.

Speaking of TripAdvisor, I get a huge kick out of the Four Seasons/Ritz Carlton types who go to Caneel and are profoundly disappointed by it. I was thinking of writing a tongue in cheek “review” about Caneel complaining about things like we had to walk up stairs to the 2nd floor Ocean View rooms (no elevators!) and, cant they do something about that sand so it doesn’t stick to your feet? But, I don’t think they would get it.”

Picture your bride here:

thanks folks for the information. JMP i missed your trip report and it contains some great info, thanks for posting. if we could get a rate like the one you got, i believe we'd go for it. especially when you consider you can eliminate renting a jeep for a week, free breakfast buffett then only evening meal. but caneel sure raises the bar for any future trips to stj.

will start checking for specials toward the end of high season 2011 for late spring or early summer specials. we were on contant point for a stay early august and too damn hot for us, but we loved the sunsets and the views were nice. we have one advantage over most travelers in that we fly free space available out if atl. all we need to do is pair flt seats with good caneel rates. as retirees, we are ready with delta has seats to a desired location.

again thanks to all.

papabou

Papabou----You might try the Turks and Caicos. Direct flight from Atlanta, hotels are close to airport, and you can stay right on the beach. A bit more like Florida but with much prettier water and sand. No panoramic views, I'm afraid, but there is pretty good snorkeling.

jim,

we did club med at T & C in may 07 and enjoyed the island but didn't like cm there, dorm type rooms & only remaining adults only cm beach resort. too much testerone in air. probably should try should look at some other lodging options there. the snorkeling about 100 yards off grace bay beach was great. that also reminds me of grand cayman. good atl flts & 7 mile beach has a variety of accommodations and great sunsets. we have enjoyed several stays there with other couples though not for 10 years. gc was favorite for me & dive buddy back in 80's. while i'm at it probably need to look at bermuda again. thought water was cold when i was younger, probably frezzing now. i know there are many other options out there, but at our age, we prefer the familiar, cuts down on the anxiety!

thanks for your suggestion. maybe bride needs a change of place that has some familiarity rather than sameoh sameoh.

papabou

Papabou, Caneel Bay is lovely, a very special place. The snorkeling from shore is really good on some of their beaches, and your bride migth enjoy relaxing on their comfortable lounge chairs under a seagrape tree with a book. There is even occasional cocktail service on the beach. Complimentary tea is offered daily at the Turtle Bay Estate House, and the breakfast buffet is really amazing.

I just wanted to let you know that Rosewood is running a special right now--stay for seven nights, pay for six. Yes, Caneel is expensive, but I really think it is worth the money. It's a unique place.

I am going to put my vote in for Caneel as well. For someone who loves St John and snorkeling like you do, it is such a treat to be able to wake up and walk to 1 of 7 beaches.
We had always done the Westin, for Starwood reasons, and 2 years ago we spent the last 3 nights at Caneel.
It was heaven. It would be difficult to go back to Westin.
You've got Honeymoon, one of my favorites; and although the swell was up a bit, Turtle and Hawksnest were fun, and RIGHT THERE.
The breakfast and lunch buffet are both fabulous, and RIGHT THERE.
Rooms are rustic luxury and I did feel pampered.
I think you will both enjoy it for different reasons.
We got a great deal for $325/night with breakfast, on Caneel Bay, and it was beautiful.
So, just try it. How can you possibly be disappointed with all that?
This year we will be doing a Villa for the 1st time and I am very excited. But, I'd go back to Caneel in a heartbeat.
Liz